Shin Box program??

[jimschubert]

Hi! And Help!

I want to achieve good shin boxes. I'm already strong, fast and explosive.

I can rise and lower smoothly into the shinbox, but the sitting bones on the side with the leg beside me are at least 4 inches above the floor. On the videos (Body-Flow™ vol.I) Scott says this a crucial target.

A second factor: in this position, if I try to get closer to the floor I experience an ache in the outer rear part of my hip socket almost as if the greater trochanter is locking against my pelvis. I have attempted to increase the anterior rotation of my pelvis in this position, but I get no movement.

I tested a shin box moving my feet further from my body. That increased the pain on the outside of my hip socket.

I tried breathing into the position and relaxing and it's like I "lock" at about 4 inches above the floor. It feels exactly like a hip lock. I have virtually no movement in my pelvis in this position (in terms of rotating the top forward). I can barely get my sitting bones onto the floor evenly if one leg is down with knee pointed out and foot in front of my groin and the other knee pointed up and the foot flat on the floor.

I don't believe time will solve this one. I worked on side splits for over a decade and never got beyond about 100 degrees and felt the same kind of locking at the hip. Someone recently suggested I "stick my butt out" which rotated my pelvis anteriorly, and I have been making rapid progress ever since. Since the locking feeling is the same, I suspect a similar biomechanical mispositioning occurs in my shin box.

How can I train to release and open this up so I can have good quality shin boxes?

I have the Body Flow book and videos, the complete Zdorovye videos, GTB, IOUF, the CST book, 5-lb. and 15-lb. Clubbells, a 1-pood and a 1.5-pood Kettlebell, traditional weights, a chinning/dip/leg raise station and a few other toys.

Thanks in advance.

[Coach Jones]

Jim,
Take out the tapes and go back over all the pelvic circles, infinities, and cloverleafs. It's hard to say without seeing you perform the shinbox but I suspect you may have already discovered the problem...


and it's like I "lock" at about 4 inches above the floor.

Unless you suffer from a pre-existing injury/condition, it's just a matter of your body resisting the movement. I would recommend taking a step back from the shinbox and really putting some time in working the ROM in the pelvis and hip area. When you free up your ROM i'll bet you drop right into it. Remember to think of it more in terms of always improving rather than perfecting.

Good luck,
-Brandon Jones, CST

[jimschubert]

When I say it's like I lock about 4 inches above the floor I mean it's like the top of my femur locks against the body of my pelvis and to move any lower would require either the progressive dislocation of my hip joint or some type of realignment of my pelvic-femoral relationship.

Despite daily work, I cannot find the adjustment direction to work in and have achieved zero progress since our last exchange.

Please let me know what elements I could explore (I'm already doing the cloverleaves, infinities, etc.)

As a possibly relevant side note, if I sit cross-legged, I cannot get my pelvis anteriorally rotated sufficiently to have a straight back, let alone a healthy slight arch in the lower back. I definitely cannot sit with my weight balanced on my sitz bones.

[Coach Jones]

Jim,

It’s hard without the benefit of actually “being there” and watching you as you perform the Shinbox. That said, here’s a couple questions for you to help me get a better idea of where your problem might be.

Have you experienced ANY increase in range-of-motion in your pelvis and hip joints since you began doing the Warrior Wellness?

How would you rate your hip-snap when swinging Clubbells?

Do you have any pre-existing condition/old injury that may be leading to your body wanting to “brace” when attempting the shinbox?

Do you train in martial arts? If so, what style and for how long?

Can you do a Cossack Squat?

How about a Shin Roll?

This info might help me to understand your situation and give you some better tips. I’m still leaning towards the pelvic range-of-motion though. If you’re having trouble moving the pelvis when sitting cross-legged as well…


As a possibly relevant side note, if I sit cross-legged, I cannot get my pelvis anteriorally rotated sufficiently to have a straight back, let alone a healthy slight arch in the lower back. I definitely cannot sit with my weight balanced on my sitz bones.

...there's definitely something going on here.

Brandon Jones
CST Head Coach

[jimschubert]

Have you experienced ANY increase in range-of-motion in your pelvis and hip joints since you began doing the Warrior Wellness™?

Not really. My standing pelvic ROM has always been good. Problems only (and have always seemd to) occur as the angle between my femur and pelvis approaches 90 degrees.

How would you rate your hip-snap when swinging Clubbells®?

Good. Explosive. Good range of motion. Swinging Clubbells is easy.

Do you have any pre-existing condition/old injury that may be leading to your body wanting to “brace” when attempting the shinbox?

Strained lower back in 1984 (17 years old) from doing too many high kicks in Hapkido class (and practicing kayaking Eskimo rolls every day).

"Lower thoracic facet strain healed with residual scar" (bad permanent sprain to my upper back around the level of the bottom of my shoulder blades) from an accident during military training in 1994 (27 years old).

Do you train in martial arts? If so, what style and for how long?

Yes. Kali (21 years), JKD (19 years), Judo (off and on for over 25 years), Boxing (like Judo), BJJ (once in a blue moon for the last couple of years). Previous training in Aikido (3 years), Muay Thai (2 years), Silat (2 years), Savate (2 years), Kung Fu (briefly in teens), Karate (briefly in teens) and Hapkido (about 3 months when I was 17).

Also served as sparring partner for competitors in Judo, Muay Thai, Tae Kwon Do and wrestling.

Can you do a Cossack Squat?

Yes. Mild discomfort in knee and outer calf of leg with knee down and heels tend to rise if muscles are cold.

How about a Shin Roll?

Yes. I enjoy these as a transitional movement from standing to the ground.

Does this help?

[Doug Szolek]

Jim, here's a few words that I've put together based on Coach Jones' thorough interview.

With Body-Flow, when we find sticking points like the one you're experiencing it generally offers minimal gains to attack the sticking point head-on. What you find is that as you move through differing but related movements you will release the tension that's causing the sticking point.

With that in mind I want to give you a couple exercises to work each day for the next two weeks with the understanding that you'll not specifically try to flatten out your shin box until after this two week hip exstensive work. The reasoning behind this is that by continually revisting the area of perceived failure you are learning (on some level) that your hips simply won't allow that range of motion; this is not true even though I suspect right now you believe it. So for the next two week no shinbox's done with the goal of getting you butt flat on the floor, agreed?

Now then, what I feel will aid the release of the tension causing the stick are the following exercises.

Shooter Squat Switch: Begin in a Shooter Squat as illustrated on page VIII of Apendix I in the Body Flow book. Project your knee far forward and center your weight down through the ball of you front foot. Allow your rear foot to remain far behind you resting on the big toe and first knuckle. The inside of your rear knee should be contacting the floor.

Roll back off of your front foot until it comes flat to the floor. As this happens the inside of your rear ankle should come to rest on the floor while your big toe knuckle remains on the floor.

Spiral your front knee in towards you and then down and foward along the ground as you weight transfer to your rear leg. From here the mechanics will be the reverse of what brought you here. Be sure to keep both feet far apart and to keep them glued to their positions on the floor.

Play with this one for 5-10 minutes making sure that you breath the entire time. If at anytime you catch yourself holding your breath then you've found some amount of trama stored in you as tension (RMT or SMA) that you're going to have to work through in your movement.

Cossak Squat Knee Switch: Directions for this one can be found on page 5 of Apendix II in the Body-Flow book. What I want you to do differently with this one is to start with a very wide Flat Foot Squat and every day as you work these bring your feet just an inch closer together (measured at the first knuckles) than they were the day before. Now I no an inch doesn't seem like much but keep in mind I want you to have a continual progression for all 14 days that your on this hip release program. Again play with these for 5-10 minutes everyday.

Walking Shin Roll: The same as the Double Shin Roll found on page 15 of Apendix II in the Body-Flow book; I want you to work this one for distance and duration and I want you to do it slowly. Move quietly and pay attention to every action of the locomotion. Again 5-10 minutes everyday.


Ok, so there you go. If you're doing these well you'll probably be walking funny for a while but I know you'll enjoy the increased hip mobility to be had from this type of play.

Let us know if this sounds good to you and be sure to keep us posted of what you find on the way.

In faith,