Increasing strength for vertical jump?

[chris hansen]

Hello,

I've been reading a little about training the vertical jump. Most of what I've encountered has talked about the importance of increasing lower body strength with exercises like heavy squats and deadlifts.

I realize that those aren't really favored exercises around here so I was wondering if there are more cst-compliant exercises that could be used? Are there better ways to improve lower body strength with the goal of jumping higher? If you were to do heavy squats and deads, what compensations would be recommended?

My goal is to jump over the fence in the backyard by Oct 31 and I need to gain about 6.5 inches to do it.

I was doing a lot before and eventually got sick from it but I've cut back dramatically. The only things I'm really working on right now is jumping over the fence and trying to learn the cst material.

Thanks.

[jerry.mobbs]

Here's some background reading

In summary you need to learn to olympic lift if you want to improve your vertical jump

Olympic lifters have higher verticals than basketball players

That explosiveness is a function of the training they do

http://www.athletedevelopmentcenter.com/olympic.html

http://humanhighlight.tripod.com/dunking/id23.html

Hope this helps

[Dan]

Vertical Jump has been discussed on the forum a few times before. I'd suggest doing a search and reviewing previous posts.

From memory, the obvious question that people will ask is "why?". Why do you want to improve your jump? How does this goal fit into the CST health-first philosophy?

Personally, improving that kind of explosiveness is something I aspire to, partially becuase I want transfer to my sport, and partially because jumping stuff is fun... but I've decided to focus on my CST-basics for the next year(prasara, CBs, Flow-Fit), because looking at the big picture I think I'll get more bang for my buck from my limited training time that way. Your needs, experiences etc are different.

Either way, good luck & have fun.

[chris hansen]

Vertical Jump has been discussed on the forum a few times before. I'd suggest doing a search and reviewing previous posts.

From memory, the obvious question that people will ask is "why?". Why do you want to improve your jump? How does this goal fit into the CST health-first philosophy?

Personally, improving that kind of explosiveness is something I aspire to, partially becuase I want transfer to my sport, and partially because jumping stuff is fun... but I've decided to focus on my CST-basics for the next year(prasara, CBs, Flow-Fit), because looking at the big picture I think I'll get more bang for my buck from my limited training time that way. Your needs, experiences etc are different.

Either way, good luck & have fun.

Thanks for the reply, I'll have to do some searching.

As to why I want to increase my vertical jump; I decided it would be cool to jump over the fence in my backyard. I don't have a particular sport or fitness goal I'm training for and I've wanted to jump the fence for a while. I'm also trying to learn the cst material but it seems like I should be able to work on both if I plan it right. After the snow starts falling it will just be cst anyway because I won't be going outside to jump over things.

[Coach Flanagan]

CST is Health-First not health-only. If you want to work on your vertical jump, go for it! I do not have any experience in this area so I will refrain from offering concrete coaching guidelines. Whatever tools you select for the job, try to create a THP to integrate the different components of the program together.

[chris hansen]

CST is Health-First not health-only. If you want to work on your vertical jump, go for it! I do not have any experience in this area so I will refrain from offering concrete coaching guidelines. Whatever tools you select for the job, try to create a THP to integrate the different components of the program together.

Thanks for the encouragement.

I'm still trying to get an understanding of the THP thing so I would really appreciate people's thoughts.

I could probably benefit by first increasing lower body strength. Besides practicing jumping over an adjustable hurdle, I've started working on pistols and have been playing with deadlifts but am not sure if thats's the best way to go. If it would be just as effective I would rather work on kettlebell/Clubbell® swings/cleans/jerks/snatches/swipes. Instead of simply doing pistols, maybe I could work on the last exercise in Flowfit® 2 which, if I remember right, is kind of a spinal-rock-pistol. I plan to start introducing faster and/or more ballistic movements later on, maybe in about 4 weeks and ramp it up again in another 4 weeks. I've seen things recommended like jump squats, olympic lifts, different kinds of plyometrics, etc but am still trying to figure out what the different options are and where they fit in.

One source I looked at suggested a minimum strength standard of deadlifting 1.5 times bodyweight or doing 5 pistols so I set a goal of doing 5 pistols by the end of 4 weeks. I forget what date that would be but I have it written down at home.

I was also thinking maybe the pigeon flow might be useful for loosening up the hip flexors a bit.

This is just my initial thoughts, as I learn more the plan might change.

Thanks.

[Matthew Barnes]

Hey Chris,

If I were you I would maybe use deads to get some extra strength in the legs but their usefulness would probably diminish quickly as they are more of a grind (slow) movement. Pistols would also be good. Have you thought about rock-its? Also rock-its with a hop at the end (one of Adam Steers THPs, "off the deep end" I think, used them) might be of some use.
Jumping high is not just about jumping up as if you were reaching for something. You have to elevate your whole center of mass as much as possible to clear a high obstacle. Have a look at some of the Sonnon Day vids on youtube. One of them shows him doing plyometric jumps in place, that would help you train that quick lift of the legs that is SOOO important when clearing obstacles.
Also try some Clubbell® cleans or snatches to get that snappy arm elevation (to get you COM up there that much more).
As always dont forget to exhale.
Why dont you post a video of you jumping as high as you can over something you CAN get over?
If you have any more questions let me know.

[shadow]

I would also consider things like shoulder park squats...

tuck jump squats (those plyometric jumps are like a tuck jump... now consider squatting first then lunching all the way up from a flat foot squat into a tuck jump)

also plyometric box jumps.


Recently I discovered my vertical leap had increased when I attempted a basketball dunk and made it... the first time ever. I think it had increased 2-4".

I wasn't training for it so it was a by-product but the above exercises were some of the ones I think contributed and were features of previous training cycles.

[jerry.mobbs]

I


Recently I discovered my vertical leap had increased when I attempted a basketball dunk and made it... the first time ever. I think it had increased 2-4".



Aren't you 7ft tall already?

[shadow]

:P

6'3"

Which, by NBA standards, would make me a point guard playing outside the box and 3 inches shorter than Michael Jordan.

I never dunked in my life until a couple of weeks ago.

[Dan]

Hi Chris

I'm glad you got some more sensible advice than what I posted!

Happy Jumping.

Dan

[chris hansen]

Thanks for the replies; they gave me some stuff to think about. I hope you don’t mind me bouncing a few more thoughts off you to get your opinions.


Hey Chris,

If I were you I would maybe use deads to get some extra strength in the legs but their usefulness would probably diminish quickly as they are more of a grind (slow) movement.


One option might be to work deads until you reach the point of diminishing returns (how do you know when you’ve reached that point?) and switch to something like power cleans.



Pistols would also be good.


I think I’d like to use pistols as a primary strength building tool. Maybe work up to sets of 5 with regular pistols and then transition to spinal rock pistols and focus on coming up as fast as possible, maybe even leaving the ground.



Have you thought about rock-its? Also rock-its with a hop at the end (one of Adam Steers THPs, "off the deep end" I think, used them) might be of some use.


I wasn’t sure if rock-its would help explosiveness as much as some other exercises or if it would be more of an endurance exercise. I suppose part of it would depend on the weight of the Clubbells. I’ll have to look for the one with the hop at the end, it sounds interesting.



Why dont you post a video of you jumping as high as you can over something you CAN get over?
If you have any more questions let me know.

That’s a good idea, I’ll see if I can figure it out. I’m having a little trouble with getting a youtube account though.



I would also consider things like shoulder park squats...

Since the heaviest Clubbells I have are 20 pounds, I wonder if the strength building potential might be limited? How about shoulder park jumping squats?



tuck jump squats (those plyometric jumps are like a tuck jump... now consider squatting first then lunching all the way up from a flat foot squat into a tuck jump)


Tuck jumps sounds like a good idea. I’m not sure what would be the best time to start working them in but I was thinking of maybe October.

Most people who feel they know vertical jump training talk about the importance of building a good strength base first. One guy insists on two years of consistent strength training before you think about plyometrics but, according to the S.A.I.D. principle, wouldn’t you get better at jumping by jumping?



also plyometric box jumps.



Do you mean like in the Rite of Passage workout? I love that exercise but since the box isn’t adjustable and it’s quite a bit lower than my goal, I wasn’t sure where it would fit in or how useful it would be.

I was kind of thinking a workout like this might be useful: http://360fitness.blogspot.com/2008/04/introduction-to-metabolic-conditioning.html
Maybe modify it a little by using longer rest periods and lower reps to emphasize power development.

I was also looking at the Rite of Passage workout which includes both box jumps and swipes.

I thought I’d divide the time available into 3 periods. In the first period I’ll focus on increasing lower body strength. In the second period I’ll start working faster movements and start introducing some light plyometrics and in the third period ramp up the fast moves and plyometrics even more.

As I understand it, just because one quality is being emphasized during a certain period, doesn’t mean the other are completely ignored, they’re just not emphasized as much but I’m still trying to understand how to balance all that.

There are so many different exercises that seem like they could help but you can’t do all of them. I think the trick would be to identify a few that would give the most bang for the buck and plan a logical progression. It’s a little confusing but I feel like I’m learning a lot by trying. I suppose I could just try something and see what happens but it would also be a little disappointing to miss my goal because I chose ineffective training strategies.

[Coach Flanagan]

Sorry if you already mentioned this and I missed it... how are you approaching the fence? Are you running and jumping or are you starting squared to it?

[shadow]

Good point Coach Sean.

There are many different ways to jump and they all don't necessarily utilise the body the same way.

[chris hansen]

Sorry if you already mentioned this and I missed it... how are you approaching the fence? Are you running and jumping or are you starting squared to it?

I stand square to it and jump.

A friend helped shoot a short video. I can try to put it on youTube but might not have time to figure it out today.

[chris hansen]

Hey Chris,

Why dont you post a video of you jumping as high as you can over something you CAN get over?


I put up a short video of me jumping over a hurdle in case anyone wants to critique my form.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fqzsJjPmrk

Thank you to everyone who has read or contributed to my posts. Your thoughts and wisdom are always appreciated.