neck training

[kblifter]

Dear Forum,

I was hoping you would share your successful neck training methods. I used to use a harness in college until it snapped off -- unsafe with any significant weight. In the past I did bridges but feel the traditional wrestler's bridge unnecessarily compresses the vertebrae. I feel the front bridge not to be as unnatural. I have also experimented with Matt Furey's 4 way headstand -- get in a headstand and rock to and fro and side to side gently.

Does anyone have safer alternatives? I am open to more efficient ways to strengthen the neck.

thank you in advance,

Will

[Scott Sonnon]

Will,

You're wise for stopping. Wrestler's bridging is a grappling technique, not an fitness exercise - (anyone teaching it otherwise is negligent).

The only neck exercise you'll ever need in situation is the Neck Roll (http://www.RMAX.tv/images/neckroll.ASF) (a video clip of me performing it in the Maximology video course, though the exercise is part of the Body-Flow curriculum.

Read my article in the "Musings" section entitled "Agility vs. Armor".

[casey]

Coach Sonnon,
I am curious when you say that wrestler's bridging is a technique and not an exercise whether you are referring to the isometric forehead-on-the-ground version some people advocate or the sort of levering-your-shoulders-up-off-of-the-ground-for-repetitions-using-your-neck-muscles that experts as varied as George Jowett and Bruce Lee have sworn by. Often when I grapple I find that the muscles at the nape of my neck and upper traps are very sore and tired afterwards and the latter version I mentioned seems like it would prepare the strength and stamina to deal with headlocks and such. What do you think of this specific version as a neck exercise? I value very, very highly your opinion and I feel like no matter how much I enjoy a certain exercise I would have to drop it if someone as knowledgable as you found it unneccessary or even dangerous. But I want to know exactly what is meant by 'bridging' in this case.

As an afterthought, does your response mean that you don't do any work for your neck other than the neck rolls and similar activities? Have you done other neck work and found it useless?

Thank you in advance for your reply, and for generously sharing your experience with all of us.

Casey

[Scott Sonnon]

I am curious when you say that wrestler's bridging is a technique and not an exercise whether you are referring to the isometric forehead-on-the-ground version some people advocate or the sort of levering-your-shoulders-up-off-of-the-ground-for-repetitions-using-your-neck-muscles that experts as varied as George Jowett and Bruce Lee have sworn by. I refer to ANY neck bridging. It was a technique designed for wrestling. The compression on the cervical vertebra causes cumulative degeneration, and the 'benefits' of such activities may be gained through safer, more efficient, and greater results producing exercises.


Often when I grapple I find that the muscles at the nape of my neck and upper traps are very sore and tired afterwards and the latter version I mentioned seems like it would prepare the strength and stamina to deal with headlocks and such. Exactly my point. It's a technique, as are many maneuvers, but creating muscle soreness does not equal health and performance benefit. One can become very sore from any laborious activity, but neither does this mean that you have done so in a health promoting way, nor does it mean that you will have performance progression of integrated attributes in this way. Soreness and fatigue are not necessarily 'good' in training, though they are often by-products of intense competition (or 'competitively' facing 'resistant' opponents.) It's only media propaganda that soreness and fatigue are positive training benefits


What do you think of this specific version as a neck exercise? I value very, very highly your opinion and I feel like no matter how much I enjoy a certain exercise I would have to drop it if someone as knowledgeable as you found it unnecessary or even dangerous. But I want to know exactly what is meant by 'bridging' in this case. Perhaps you are one of the few who have the vertebral structure which can sustain such angular sheer and compressive force over the years. Perhaps you are young enough that you won't see any adverse affects from this activity for awhile. However, most people will accumulate chronic conditions from such activity, and there are without doubt more efficient, safer, and greater results producing methods of accomplishing the goal than this family of "neck-bridging" exercises.

I'm on no crusade to vanquish the heathens who proselytize neck-bridging as the panacea of fitness, but I cannot with good conscience endorse such a method here at CST Forums.


As an afterthought, does your response mean that you don't do any work for your neck other than the neck rolls and similar activities? Have you done other neck work and found it useless? I do no other exercises than Body-Flow Biomechanical Exercise and Clubbells for Circular Strength Training.

There's old Soviet footage of a teenage Sambo wrestler performing advanced neck-bridging exercises in the introduction of an old video of mine. Then alternative exercise suggestions are made using Biomechanical Exercise from my system - a ROSS vs. SAMBO training demonstration in the introduction.

I've experimented with just about every method out there as an international athlete and national coach. I needed to find the best methods promising the greatest results for the longest athletic careers. CST is the culmination of those 15 years.

[Doug Szolek]

Casey,

with a melon like mine, my neck has to be both strong and mobile for efficient grappling and fisticuffs. I fulfill both of these needs with the neck roll. Try it out for a month in place of your current bridging work, if you don't feel as though it works then you can always go back to the bridge.

As a side note, my neck has also been gaining some very unexpected strength from the mild impact of landing the Bruiser in Shoulder Park during the Clockwork Squat. It's always nice to get the extra strength but this has definately translated to increased time on my neck mobility drills during my Warrior Wellness practice.

[casey]

Thank you both Coaches Sonnon and Szolek for the responses. I am always surpirsed by how quickly answers come on this forum and how thorough they are. Coach Sonnon you answered my question precisely. And Cozch Szolek I will do neck rolls instead of bridging and check my results. I have performed neck rolls before and enjoyed them, but never really put much work in.

Thanks Again,
Casey

[jimmy23]

Coach, could you give some hints as to how one can work into the neck roll? I just attemtped it and dont "get it", any help would be appreciated :)

[Scott Sonnon]

James, where are you getting stuck? Tell me what's happening.

[jimmy23]

I am having trouble iat the beginning of the movement, I cant seem to feel how get my legs and hips moving forward and up

[Scott Sonnon]

Lay pronated crucifix style.
Turn your head to one side.
Begin a horizontal version of "Screwing Arms" exercise, rolling the shoulder down which lay opposite of the direction you turned your head. This lifts your opposite shoulder.
http://www.circularstrength.com/images/warrior3.gif
Tilt your head under the lifted armpit as if moving chin to chest.
Continuing rotating the opposite arm, beginning with the shoulder, attempting to move from palm down to palm down 360 degrees later.
http://www.circularstrength.com/images/neckroll2.gif
Tilt your pelvis upward and exhale hard with Performance Breathing.
As per Performance Breathing, your core should be tight and compressed now - neither vacuum nor Valsalva.
Contract your core musculature to drag your legs.
Simultaneously continue Screwing Arms.
Allow your hips to move in a crescent so that your feet drag directly towards your head.
http://www.circularstrength.com/images/neckroll1.gif
Go ultra-slow so that you prevent roll-over and can transition to the Neck Roll.
Keep moving chin to chest and when your head frees begin to turn your head back to center. You arrive in Spinal Rock position (AKA the "plough" in Yoga).
http://www.circularstrength.com/images/bebreathed.gif
Reverse the above directions to complete the exercise.

[jimmy23]

thanks coach :)

[jimmy23]

ok, I see my main problem is I will ahve to work the spinal rock , thats is where the exercise falls apart for me. THanks for the advice :D

[Jay76]

Is running a biomechanial exercise?

[Scott Sonnon]

Jay, the following I take from the Musings - "Lift Up to Grow Up" -
Recently, I was sent a thread from an external forum. One erroneous statement must be addressed: that any movement could qualify as a Biomechanical Exercise (a phrase trademarked protected by RMAX.tv Productions coined in 1997 by yours truly). This couldn’t be farther from the truth as anyone who actually ENGAGES the methodology knows intuitively as well as empirically.

Biomechanical Exercise is not a thing; it’s a methodology… an approach. It is a vehicle to movement freedom. It’s a blueprint for CREATING ORIGINAL MOVEMENT… (and following the Body-Flow™ philosophy, therefore, it is a doorway for creating original thought, spontaneous personhood.)

So to set the record straight, what follows is the most succinct and exhaustive explanation of the Biomechanical Exercise™ Methodology.

The Elementary Motor Component Methodology (EMC) deconstructs a motion into the smallest divisible units of motion, called an EMC, which integrates breathing, movement and structure. The EMC is a part of a larger structure called a Biomechanical Exercise – within which it is either the beginning, middle or ending component.

The Biomechanical Exercise Methodology (BME) applies to any motion and equipment used if it observes the following criteria:
The BME efficiently integrates breathing, movement and structure (Performance Breathing).
The BME seamlessly “matches” together a beginning, middle and ending EMCs.
The BME equipment should be an extension of the body (such as the Clubbell an extension of the arm in swing).
The BME force roots from the ground and amplifies by the rotational torque of bodily segments (Circular Strength Training™).
The BME is explored under the Slow and Smooth Protocol in order to improve the sophistication of the motion each time, rather than merely practiced in repetition format.
The BME works specifically to interrupt, resolve, and/or discharge Fear-Reactivity™.
The BME intends to be incorporated in a larger Kinetic Chain. The Kinetic Chain Methodology (KC) must observe the following criteria:
A KC seamlessly links two or more BMEs with no “bound-flow” (stopping points in flow continuity.)
A KC links BMEs by a Match (perfect coupling of EMCs), Patch (addition of an EMC to create a Match) or Hem (omission of an EMC to create a Match.)
A KC seeks to increase one’s personal sophistication (Sophisticated Training Protocol - synergistically incorporates any combination of coordination, agility, and balance in such a way that the sum total training effect is greater than if any of the attributes were addressed independently. It intends to be EXPLORED and DEEPENED rather than robotically repeated and intensified.)
A KC “unbinds flow” by transferring proprioceptive benefits to all of one’s physical existence (Perpetual Exercise).
A KC removes Over-Flow (contains no superfluous activity in breathing, movement or structure; no elements lacks deliberate action or attention.)
A KC promotes Body-Flow (movement precedes feelings which precedes thoughts; or in other words, how you move determines your self-image… who you are.)

Please tell me the answer to your question.

[Jay76]

you answered it. :D :D

[bob_stra]

Lay pronated crucifix style.
Turn your head to one side.
Begin a horizontal version of "Screwing Arms" exercise, rolling the shoulder down which lay opposite of the direction you turned your head.

Friggin brilliant. All this time.... the secret was screwing arms.

D'oh

:oops:

Man, I can be d-e-n-s-e sometimes

:oops:

[tyciol]

Besides the neck roll (which is still a bit of a tricky move for me, and besides reps and intuition not sure how to make it harder) are there measurable weight-lifting or resistance techniques one can use to strengthen the neck? Like those harnesses you can attach to pulleys at gyms for example.

Or an isometric fashion, like I know we have self-resistance which is also intuition-based but it seems like using some posture variations might do it. Like, if I was doing bent-over rows for the upper back and rested my head on a pad to take some strain off the spinal extensors, could bearing that weight on something below me in that prone torso position use neck flexors and jaw-closers?

Or in the reverse, if I was doing glute bridges resting my upper body on a couch, if I were to rest my head alone instead of head+scapulae then would I be working my cervical and thoracic too instead of only the lumbar muscles?

[Joseph David]

Jorden, to safely integrate and strengthen the neck, take the template from IntuFlow and apply that while the body has different relationships to gravity than standing, Do cardinals, circles infinities and clovers while prone, supine and side-lying.