SHoulder Stability Question

[jimmy23]

TOnight I was back trainign in grappling for the first time since shoulder injury a few months ago. THe injury was caused by my left arm somehow being pulled directly to my side, and popping out of socket for a brief instant, while rolling. The pain was felt in the muscle under the armpit, going out along the bicep. For ten or so days the area on the inside of my arm near the elbowq was purple, thsi is farther down the arm than the injury but my guess is blood from the injury pooled there.

Anyway, I wnet and did some grapplign tonight and was ok, but I also coach and ran into one paticular issue. While showing a big guy how to throw a left hook , I held a focus mitt. As his power increased, it felt as if my shoulder was "popping" out a bit from the blow.

DOes anyone have any idea what this means or how I can help stabilize the shoulder at this angle?

[Robert V]

I injured my shoulder throwing "hooks" a few years ago, also. They are fine now.

You have four joints in your shoulder. Explore the range of motion of all your shoulder joints.

Don't forget to explore the range of motion of all the joints in your hips, spine and legs. (Kinetic chain) There may be a connection.

"Warrior Wellness"

[Scott Sonnon]

James, you should really see a doctor. Such subluxation needs examination, amigo.

[jimmy23]

I should, but with the economy the way it is I have lost my insurance. Its ok, for a few thousand years people did without modern medical care and seemed to do ok, hopefully when i graduate school in MAy ill get a job with benefits and be able to get a doctor to check me out.


All of us old warhorses have injuries though, its almost like a badge of honor ;)

[bob_stra]

> I should, but with the economy the way it is I have lost my insurance.

Man... you Americans and that health insurance thing. It's weird to me. Still, knowing next to nothing abt the situation, I'll shut my piehole on the topic ;-)

I can *guess* (note emphasis) why your shoulder hurts. Do you realize that everytime you absorbed a jab, you are literally throwing your shoulder out of your socket? The effect is even more pronounced when you, for example, pitch a baseball, hit an overhead smash in tennis. (though of course, in different directions)

You are throwing the arm *literally* away. Like twisting off a chicken wing. For this to not be catastrophic, the surrounding tissue needs to be strong. Meaning, the joint capsule and the rotator cuff muscles.

Now, if you injure one of those tissues and then try to stabilize the arm...well, the force is still there, but your body can't deal with it. And then you hurt.

Kapish?

Long story short - you need to get it checked out, if only to find out the specifics of the injury. Community health care clinic?PT? AT? OT? DC?

It might be the best $20-$40 you ever spend.

I've got a gut feeling that the answer will be a combination of strengthening exercises (isometric & theraband) and soft tissue therapy.
Perhaps something like isometric door pull downs - standing behind a door, grabbing the top of it and gently pulling downward (*not* a pullup). And variations thereof of different heights. (FWIW, isometrics and TENS are often initially used in rehab work)

Then again, this might not be possible in your current situation. I have no idea, so use your own judgement.

If you're really stubborn, perhaps googling for +shoulder +rehab +exercises. The first pages I found were

http://www.uoregon.edu/~athmed/scaprhythm/rehab.html
http://home.xtra.co.nz/hosts/eugene/flexion.htm

But I'm only guessing. Not even Mother Teresa works miracles over the net ;-)

PS: Did I mention - see a Dr? *checks* Good.

[Scott Sonnon]

Solid advice from Bob as usual.

[jimmy23]

Excellent advice, and thanks for the links.

Right now, the only time the injuryhas become an issue is absorbing the impact when the guys throw strong hooks. Im facing the puncher in a boxing stance myself, the arm with the focus mitt is held straight in front , and is knocked to my left (out from my center line) by the punch.

Part of the problem is the guy I was coaching is just learning to punch properly,he is big strong and clumsy. He was pushing way through the punch, and not hitting the mitt. As a result, my hand was getting moved much farther than a stronger, properly thown punch would move it. I consider myself a pretty good "mitt man" and have never had this problem before.

When I rolled earlier in the night, the arm held up well. In retospect, I think I had the mitt tooo far away from my body while I was coaching.

Also, I just remembered some advice given me by my boxing guru, that I think i neglected while teaching. When holding the mitts, you "mirror" the punch being thrown - for a right cross you push the mitt forward along your centerline, same body mechanics as if you yourself were throwing a cross. This gives the puncher a good solid target and protects the mitt man . I wasnt doing for this guys hook though. I find it easier to do when someone knows the punch, timing the mitt motion is easier becuaseI know when the punch will land. The guy was, as I said , pretty new to this and I wasnt really able to time the mitt correctly.

Most of my experience holding mitts has been with guys who already know how to punch , working on sharpening up what they can already do. The last few months Ive been working more with newer people, most with no striking background. Im goign to have to go back into "learning mode" and adjust what I do to be a better teacher, and to protect myself also.

Sorry to rant, but Ive been thinking about this a lot today . Holding the mitts properly is an almost unknown skill in most MMA gyms Ive seen (and it is a skill, there are guys in pro boxing gyms that only hold mitts) and Ive been working out different methods to use mitts properly for MMA training. Ive developed nice clinch drills and takedown drills for the advanced guys to work on mixing boxing with grappling, but have neglected ways to get beginners up to speed and to keep the coach safe at the same time.

THanks for your time everyone, and for giving me a chance to verbalize this and make some sense of it.

[bob_stra]

> Excellent advice, and thanks for the links.

No worries

<snip>

I actually have a great link for you on feeding pads "properly". It's a video clip from SBG - only a snippet (5 seconds) is actually abt pad feeding...but it's changed my perspective on it completely.

Click "save as"

http://www.jkd-kbh.dk/sbg2.wmv
(abt 14mb IIRC)

[jimmy23]

*hijacks own thread*

Excellent clip there!!!!!

Most of the mitt drills I use focus on what i consider to be the biggest problem area for most MMA guys - mixing close range boxing and clinch fighting , and throwing attacks as a clinch breaks as a clinch forms. Too many MMA schools put way too much emphasis on grappling and have terrible entries to the clinch , dont punch when the clinch opens (when the guys are leaving bodyto body or clinch range goign back into boxing range) and badd habits formed from too much standup clinching without integrating strikes. Ill give an example of a clinch drill I do.

Fighter throws one right cross, coach closes gap and drives lead shoulder into fighters chest, smothering further attacks. Coach leans into fighter, tries to tie up his elbows and head and keep him off balance, pummeling and pushing is done. THen Coach SHOVES fighter back , strikes high with left , fighter blocks and fighter throws lead hook/right cross combo , trainer charges in again, repeat. By varying the timing of the clinch portion of the drill, and by actively pummeling the fighter while in the clinch, this changes basic mitt work from a boring reptition drill to something more closely resembling a fight. It allows a fighter to work a difficult range of combat without fear of getting hit too hard,( a slap to the head with mitts is louder than it is damaging) and the old coach gets some work in also.

I have a few more like this, but I think this one gives you an idea of what I shoot for when I work with more advanced fighters.