Coach Sonnon & others: Prolotherapy & back pain ?'s

[hugojkd]

Hi coach,

I had ?'s on back pain & prolotherapy.

A couple of years ago I got treatment on a traction machine called a VAX-D which really helped out. When I started, I had 2 buldging & 1 herniated disk in my lower back. When the treatment ended, the herniated disk became a buldge & the buldging disks went away.

I still get pain in my lower back, especially when I grappel. I've tried doing DB cleans & DB snatches to work my lower back & hamstrings, but a lot of times when I do them my back pops out of place & will hurt for days or even a couple of weeks.

When lifting, I make sure to do all the things Pavel & other mentions like tightening my abs, glutes, thighs, & taint. Regardless, my back still pops out of place, & this is doing doubles & singles with a 50 lb dumbell.

In the future I'd like to work with CB's, but there's no way I'll be able to till I get this back issue resolved.

Keep in mind, I do the 3rd WW workout almost everyday & it helps, but my back still goes out al the time. Are there other Z-Health type excercises which may help?

I don't understand why this happens, especially since I've had treatment & it's been like 2 years. My guess is the tendos & ligaments in my lower back are too weak to keep my vertebre in place.

I was thinking of trying prolotherapy, which seems pretty popular for back pains.

Any suggetions?

Thanks in advance,

Hugo

[Scott Sonnon]

Hugo, perhaps someone else knows more about prolotherapy. Sorry.

[bob_stra]

I've never read anything in the journals to suggest that prolotherapy has any effect on *herniated discs*.

Still, it'd be worth your while to search on the following sites -

http://www.embase.com/demo
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=PubMed
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/slippeddisk.html
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?
http://www.cochrane.org/

FWIW, prolo is based on a very old idea (glucose injections), so there should be something out there.

The fact that the VAX-D was useful to you makes me think you should ask your doctor if the use of a home traction device might be helpful (eg: gravity inversion swing). They're cheap to obtain, but ask your doctor first. You might also consider visiting a chiropractor / osteopath to get their point of view - depending on what you read, SMT has had some remarkable effects on "slipped discs"

[hugojkd]

Thanks for the help gentlemen.

BTW, what's SMT stand for?

I'm sure the answer is obvious & I apologize in advance for my ignorance :? .

Hugo

[bob_stra]

Thanks for the help gentlemen.

BTW, what's SMT stand for?

I'm sure the answer is obvious & I apologize in advance for my ignorance :? .

Hugo

Spinal Manipulation Therapy

You should be able to dig up some simple to read research on SMT and herniated discs from here

http://www.chiroweb.com/

[Jarlo Ilano]

Prolotherapy is the injection of a proliferant into specific areas, with the goal of scarring to stabilize hypermobile areas. Part of the theory is that in some people, there are ligamentous instabilities which cause a joint to move beyond the "neutral zone" of controllable range, thus causing pain.

Prolotherapy is generally used when stabilization therapy through other means, such as muscle reeducation and strengthening have not worked to satisfaction.

You may want to check with a physical therapist or osteopath to see what your dysfunction really is and go from there. Also, read about Coach Sonnon's ideas on "core" strengthening, and employ his activation strategies. He outlines it in one of his musings.

It may interest you to know that a great percentage of the population has disc bulging and herniations without having symptoms. The cause of your back problems may have the discs only as a contributing factor rather than your primary problem. Remember that the disc acts as "ball bearing" between your spinal joints, rather than as shock absorption, thus damage to it may affect the axis of rotation at the facet joints, so your feeling of the back going out may be due muscle reactivity secondary to facet joint displacement. So you may be right about "weakness".

I would check with a P.T., but you should know that I am biased because I am a physical therapist. =)

Hope you find what helps.

Jarlo

[bob_stra]

It may interest you to know that a great percentage of the population has disc bulging and herniations without having symptoms. The cause of your back problems may have the discs only as a contributing factor rather than your primary problem.
Jarlo

Ditto.

http://www.chiroweb.com/archives/18/05/01.html

FWIW During the seminar I attended last year, one of the key note speakers (orthopedic surgeon) estimated that as the figure as high as 60% in those over the age of 40. He said that most cases were asymptomatic, and weren't detectable without a MRI.

[Chapinho]

I dislocated my shoulder back in June at at grappling tournament. A guy sprawled hard onto my outstretched arm. Anyway, I tried to keep it mobilized for three weeks but decided after a week that I need to get something done or else I was looking at surgery. So I went to www.getprolo.com and found a local doctor.

Well, in my case, prolotherapy help save me from surgery. I am back to grappling 100%. I still have some minor aches and pains and alittle looseness but nothing close to the instability I felt right after my injury. I had about 5 sessions and it worked great! So about 2 months after the injury and after only two sessions I was back rolling pretty hard. After 5 sessions I was back to competition level.

As for your situation, they have studies for herniated disk and other back injuries. I would do the reasearch and talk to a prolotherapist. Always weigh your options and never take surgery as your first option. Prolo can't hurt, it can only help. So there is really no reason why you can't try it. It may or may not work. But surgery is final and if they mess you up then you are done!!! Not saying prolo is the only option, just saying it may be a good thing to try.

here is another site... www.sportsprolo.com