"Crashes" not induce by sugar

[Coach Gostnell]

I recently thought I was ordering Potatoes Not Prozac, received Little Sugar Addicts instead but decided to read it even though my child-rearing years are long gone (and let's hope they don't come again for some reason when I'm in my dotage :!: )

My dear friend and co-worker has a 10-year old daughter who has behaviors that are nearly blow-by-blow descriptions of those in Katherine's book. However, after much discussion, we correlated these crashes not to food, but to the girl's long-distance telephone conversations with her father. My friend left him when the child was an infant because of life-threatening abuse, but she still must allow contact, visitation, etc.

When the girl got home from an 8-week visit at the end of August, she had a series of tantrums over several days, one of which lasted for HOURS.
She and her mom have been going to counseling since September, but the outbursts continue.

My very non-professional opinion is when talking to her father, the girl is experiencing a flight-fight-or-freeze situation, a huge adrenaline dump into her bloodsteam along with all the hormones/chemicals that get triggered by that, some of which are also implicated in sugar rushes. If that's the case, it's not hard to see that a crash isn't far behind.

At this point, not much can be done about contact with the father - if the child doesn't speak to him when he calls, he phones continually until she does talk with him. He's done cute stuff, like threaten suicide because she let him down in some minor matter, etc.

Hopefully the counselling will help and eventually a case be built to overturn his visitation rights, or she'll survive for a few more years until she gets to decide for herself.

Right now, she's also involved in dance and gymnastics, so she's getting some good physical workouts.

Her mom is reading Little Sugar Addicts, at least as soon as I'm done with it, already buys/uses very little sugar products, etc. but is there anything you can think of that might be done nutritionally to help this child through these always unpredictably-timed calls and their fallout? - hand her a piece of cheese or a boiled egg while she talks to him? Dose her with valerian as soon as the phone rings?

It's very painful to watch the toll this is taking on an otherwise well-functioning family and I think my friend would quickly try to implement any suggestions to help make the situation better.

Thanks,

[Connie Brown]

I will call Kathleen's attention to this one.

But this I think from watching people over at RR: there is no antidote for the BE / adrenaline system dump once it happens to an upregulated person.
All we have for prevention is raising overall BE levels and behavior mod to prevent/moderate the impact of a necessary life situation. (I think - right Kathleen?)

Oh I also forgot! At 10 years old the hormones of puberty add to the volume of the situation. The hormones start fluctuating before we ever see the visible signs, sometimes by as much as 2 years.

However if I were the mom, I would seriously pursue a change to the visitation for medical / psych reasons. I know the kiddie shrink our family worked with (through our relatively non-horrible post-divorce times) was johnny on the spot for depression or any signs of trauma.

[Coach Gostnell]

Thanks, Connie, you're pretty johnny-on-the-spot yourself.
We're heading out of town tonight for a few days, but I'll check back later to see what Kathleen might have to say. No doubt the therapist is or will be working also with the kid on ways to handle herself when dealing with this emotionally abusive parent - sounds like she needs all the help she can get.

[radiantkd]

I have a couple of thoughts....in children sugar is not always the main culprit. Having enough to eat, on time and a higher percentage of protein makes a huge difference. So that would be the first thing I would check...

Now, from a BE perspective..yes, of course what you are thinking is one target.

But from a clinical point of view, I think there needs to be some sort of family intervention. If the dad had threatened suicide to the child, this is so far out of bounds that some boundaries need to be established. I think the child is being asked to hold too much. Looking at the food will help. Counseling will help. But someone needs to rein dad in or only have supervised visitation. If mom left the situation because the dad is abusive what on earth is she doing sending a 10 year old there for 8 weeks.

Sorry, that is my protective .02 cents worth.

Kathleen

[radiantkd]

I have a couple of thoughts....in children sugar is not always the main culprit. Having enough to eat, on time and a higher percentage of protein makes a huge difference. So that would be the first thing I would check...

Now, from a BE perspective..yes, of course what you are thinking is one target.

But from a clinical point of view, I think there needs to be some sort of family intervention. If the dad had threatened suicide to the child, this is so far out of bounds that some boundaries need to be established. I think the child is being asked to hold too much. Looking at the food will help. Counseling will help. But someone needs to rein dad in or only have supervised visitation. If mom left the situation because the dad is abusive what on earth is she doing sending a 10 year old there for 8 weeks.

Sorry, that is my protective .02 cents worth.

Kathleen

[radiantkd]

I have a couple of thoughts....in children sugar is not always the main culprit. Having enough to eat, on time and a higher percentage of protein makes a huge difference. So that would be the first thing I would check...

Now, from a BE perspective..yes, of course what you are thinking is one target.

But from a clinical point of view, I think there needs to be some sort of family intervention. If the dad had threatened suicide to the child, this is so far out of bounds that some boundaries need to be established. I think the child is being asked to hold too much. Looking at the food will help. Counseling will help. But someone needs to rein dad in or only have supervised visitation. If mom left the situation because the dad is abusive what on earth is she doing sending a 10 year old there for 8 weeks.

Sorry, that is my protective .02 cents worth.

[Coach Gostnell]

Kathleen,
Thank you for your response.

But someone needs to rein dad in or only have supervised visitation. If mom left the situation because the dad is abusive what on earth is she doing sending a 10 year old there for 8 weeks.

Do I agree and yes, that was my question, way back when. The answer is she has few other choices at this point. The visits are court-ordered. (Remember that the courts have ordered unsupervised visits even in cases where the father has murdered the mother & is now out of prison.)

The situation was not as severe when the child was younger and less of her own person. He was very doting with her before she had the intellect and judgement to begin noticing and disliking how he treats others and the games he plays. Now he's starting to treat her the same way - she says he uses "his other people's voice" with her sometimes now. Chilling.

My friend complies only because her other choice is to take the kid and go on the run - something she has seriously considered but which has dire consequences if it doesn't work or even if it does. So much for any semblance of a normal life. One of the reasons she's in counseling now is for the counselor to assess the situation and possibly make a recommendation to the court to change the visitation. The therapist is with a local non-profit organization that has tremendous credibility with the courts.

I worked with this organization some years ago and think there's a good chance this strategy will succeed, and in the meantime, I will pass on what you've written here about diet, as well as your book.

Today it also occurred to me that the girl could start journaling right after every phone call, even is she only writes down one feeling, or draws one little picture to start with - like an "emoticon" perhaps. It would be completely hers & completely private - there's enough respect and good boundaries in her mom's family to make that feasible.

Thanks again.
Jean

[radiantkd]

Yah, I know. I just hate this stuff. I am glad you are there to be supportive. It evokes such a primal response in me.

Kathleen